Hey everyone,

Hope everyone's well. Been a busy week at work and busy weekend at home with the dogs, so haven't been able to write for a while. So many little things have been happening - some funny, some endearing, some super-annoying, some a tad concerning and some exhilarating - so I am just gonna type in some random snippets which should, in the aggregate, give you all a sense of how lil Vassily's doing here, and also throw out for discussion and inputs some of the issues am unclear on

The Gladiators - Gemma and Vassily have been getting along quite well. But, they do play rough. Gemma, as I may have mentioned before, is a bit of a livewire.......she athletically and effortlessly does things like leap clear over the sofa and land on the other side and acts like it's all in a day's work while everyone watches in amazement and horror......she's also therefore, a bit of a showoff and attention-seeker. And so she plays rough with Vassily and always wants him to keep playing even after he's tired......which would have been ok if Vassily were a little bigger. But though he is smaller, he wants to play just like her and rough her up the way she roughs him up (he does things like take a run up and leaps on her with his jaws open like a croc....or just tries to bulldoze himself thru her using the momentum of the run-up)......and hence, we have two gladiators going for each other (as a sport, of course, not as a war) So, I have to frequently keep stepping in and telling them to "cut it out!". Once in a while, I have had to put one of them (whoever is the offender on that occasion, usually Gemma) away in a different room.....and I think they now are beginning to understand the message. But the primal instincts to play around like littermates still exist. I sometimes put Vassily away even if he isn't the offender cos he needs to sleep.

The Talkative Man - Gemma and Vassily are two opposite poles! Gemma barks so rarely that when she does, am like "Wow.....go on baby!!!!". Vassily, on the other hand, is a very talkative young man. He often has opinions on matters, and he often conveys them to us. Sometimes, when I tick off Gemma cos she's been playing a lil rough with him, he walks over, sits down and "tells me" to stop ticking her off. On the rare occasions that he wants to play and Gemma doesnt, he "admonishes her" for being lazy. (I say admonishes because his face has that aggrieved look at such times). And oh my God, when he's crated.......he becomes very vocal in communicating his displeasure. I put up with it for a while and then, I step in to that room and tell him "No shouting....QUIET!"....it usually works.

The Watch Dog - Gemma has a simple rule in life - all humans are good and are therefore, friends. Cows, other dogs that are not friendly, cats, birds, sudden and unexpected noises at night.....those are the things to watch out for and be suspicious about. Vassily's rule is a lot different. ANYONE, except me, Rajan (my domestic helper) and Gemma entering the house is "suspicious activity" and requires alertness. He has now also accepted my driver as part of this accepted circle......and also a couple of friends who have visited more than twice. I have been working a lot on making him relax......and I think he's improving. He still barks loudly when he sees any strange person at the door or whenever the doorbell rings, but he grudgingly accepts it when i tell him a few times that the person concerned is ok. I think it might be a good idea for me to figure out a way to teach him a command like "Friends" or something like that which tells him it is ok and he is to stop barking and being suspicious. Any thoughts anyone on how I can do this? I know this is possible - I have seen a rottie which came at me growling and then eased up when the owner said I was a "friend".

Growling - I don't know if growling to a certain extent is acceptable in a working breed puppy or whether it is totally unacceptable. He growls a lot while playing with Gemma. It doesn't sound aggressive to me, but am not sure. Is he just playing and making noises of enjoyment or is he actually growling at her in fear or aggression? I am very concerned that there never be a situation where he bites her out of fear or aggression. Now is fine cos he's small, but soon he will be bigger than her and then is he gonna start getting more pushy with her.....is this growling a precursor to that? For the most part, while playing with her, he has this puppyish yap-yap-yap noise....and then every now and then (typically, in situations where they are both tugging at the same object, or other such "competitive" situations) he sorta growls at her. Like I said, it doesn't sound aggressive to me, but am not sure. Helene, your thoughts on this one, please? By the way, while he lets me touch him almost everywhere (only yesterday did I find out the "almost" bit), when i moved my hand close to his genitals, he growled. I said "No Vassily" and kept my hand where it was without moving. But he growled again. I again said "No" and he stopped growling, but his body was very alert and stif though he was lying down......so I just kept my hand close to there for a bit......and then casually moved it away......didn't wanna push this issue without understanding it better. So, what do i do abt this? Is this fine or does it need to be dealt with now?

Food - Vassily's on kibble and he seems to like it. One day, I decided to try feeding Gemma and him Butch (I am very suspicious about risk of meat contamination here, so I just trust stuff like Butch which is processed and packaged.....but still more nutritious presumably, than just kibble). Gemma, who was beginning to get very disinterested in her kibble of late, just LOVED the change to Butch and devoured her food. Surprisingly, Vassily (who eats a LOT more kibble than Gemma does) was having difficulty eating the Butch meat (it's basically minced lamb mixed with a little bit of rice, vegetables etc) and was going really slow. So, after 10 minutes, whatever he didn finish, I took away. TWO MINUTES after that, he started throwing up all that he just ate!!! After this, I went back to just giving him kibble, which he continues to gorge on. Was he just having a bad day? Is he allergic to something in Butch? Or is it just a case of his young tummy couldn't handle the sudden change in food? And.......when do I start increasing his food quantity (right now I feed 3 cups of kibble twice a day). He weighed 32 pounds when I weighed him last Friday.

Okay, so that was a REALLY long update post and I hope I have more than made up for my long silence Thank you for your patient reading, and thank you in anticipation of all your inputs and advice.

Vijay

I am so glad you posted. I have some responses to some of your inquiries. Growling...it is normal for dogs to growl when they play. The body language will tell you when it is not play anymore and the intensity will usually be noticeably different. Some dogs growl more in play, others not much. Laika makes a noise like Chewbaca sometimes and it is outrageously funny. I would not worry as long as everybody is getting along. The food...it is normal for a dog to vomit if he's eaten too much too fast. You will sometimes see that when they gulp their food. While that is not a desirable outcome, it is nothing to really worry about. Humans can have the same reaction if they gorge themselves. As far as food consumption, his littermates are eating between 4 and 6 cups, depending on their activity level...he wasn't really one that would hog the bowl, so I think his appetite is normal and healthy. You should be able to follow the feeding advice given elsewhere on the forum (10 minutes at mealtimes then take it away, etc.) and have a clear picture of what is the right amount for him. Suspiciousness of strangers...what you describe is textbook BRT and that is "built in" so you can be thankful that you had an excellent breeder (hahaha). But seriously, the suspicion of strangers is hardwired into the BRTs, and that is why you have to teach them to trust YOUR opinion and guidance regarding new people. Giving the "friend" command is an excellent way to do that, but you'll need to find people to help you over time so that he can learn by repetition what you mean when you tell him that someone is a friend.

Thanks, Jeannie, for your responses. I thought as much that the growling was a play-growl. As I said, it didn't seem to me like the growl was aggressive (except for when my hand got too close to his you-know-what yesterday) but I just wanted to be sure

On the food, so you are saying that I can try giving him the Butch meat again to see how it goes? Am also trying to get fish oil so I can include in his diet.

As for the "friends" command, how exactly would I go about establishing that association of the command and what it means to him? Sounds like a tough one to train him to do On the training front, he's thus far learnt to consistently sit and down (though for the down command, he gets it only if I simultaneously also put my hand on the ground when i say "down"). I used to use "down" with Gemma to tell her to get off the sofa, but now I've started using "get off" for both dogs, so as to avoid confusion with the "down" that I have been teaching Vassily. He's also learned the "take a break" command and it now works consistently. Helene had trained him already on this, but it wasn't working all the time. So I spent some time on it and now he goes as soon as I say "take a break"........only.....he still needs to get it that he cannot go at other times (i.e., inside the house for example)

I have invited a new set of friends over this weekend> I generally have been inviting my friends in smaller groups (no more than 2 people at a time). This is because (i) he may get intimidated or confused by so many people in the house all at once, and (ii) people coming home in smaller groups makes for more socialization events for him than them all coming over at once.

Vijay

And as for the "textbook BRT", you certainly have done a great job.........so should we now call you the "Textbook Breeder"?

I had to laugh reading your post as this sounds very much like our house. I have two 16 month old BRTs and they interact just like this. Callie is 100 mph with her hair on fire and is never quiet. She is so vocal we call her Miss Mouth. When she doesn't get her way she is a total drama queen and makes a hilarious, high pitched "Oh" sound and throws herself on the floor like she is a southern belle having the vapors during time outs. When they play hard they both make growly sounds but it is at a higher pitch than when they are alerting on something. I listen for a change in that tone and then separate them for a while. Their favorite game is to chase each other around our curved home theater couch but Callie sometimes cheats and goes over the back to catch Vladimir mid run. Vladimir is a mellow goofball and does need more rest. I find a diversion for Callie when he needs a nap.
Vladimir has rumbled at me a few times but never shown his teeth or tried to bite. It's usually when he is tired after a long play session and wants a nap or when he needs a break from grooming. It's his only way to communicate so I stay calm and respect his right to say enough already. Raising two is a lot of work but so much fun I can't imagine life without them both. Tina

Hahaha, thanks, Tina for sharing that - I laughed too Yes, the situation is very similar in my house, except that my dogs are different breeds and different ages. Gemma is a 15.5 months old golden retriever and Vassily is a 3.5 months old BRT. And both are very attention-oriented dogs so the minute I touch one of them, the other one instantly drops everything and comes rushing over to be close to me. And Vassily is now getting into that confident and active stage, so I have my hands full making sure they behave And their personalities are SO different from each other, it's fascinating.

I just woke up........when Vassily jumped on to the bed and on me! He is now ABLE to get on the furniture, and I have to teach him that he is not allowed to. A 32 pound pup jumping up on me while am asleep is cute, but I shudder at the thought of a 100 pounder doing the same thing!!!

But I think my idea of using Gemma as a "demo artist" is paying off. Vassily just "shook hands"!!!!! I thought it might be a fluke coincidence, but he got it six times in a row just now Next I have to teach him to "stay" and then "fetch". Once he gets those, I'll teach him the "find" game I play with Gemma

Jeannie, by the way, did you see the photos of Vassily and Gemma that I put up? It's on a seperate thread.

Vijay

Vijay, I did see those pictures and I want more!!! It is so great to be able to keep up with those babies. I adore them all! And believe me I KNOW about the attention hog thing. I have 2 adults and two of Vassily's littermates that all vie for my attention at the same time. Puppies are still using their teeth, but Bruce and Laika just use their weight. That's basically 250 pounds of black fuzzy dogflesh and I am at the bottom of the dogpile. It's fun, but I have to take a bath afterward.

Wow, Jeannie, you must be strong to have 250 pounds of dog piled up on you

Vijay,
I wish you all the luck in keeping your BRT off the bed. Callie sneaks in for snuggles after we turn out the light and my morning wouldn't be complete if Vladimir didn't wake me up by standing on my chest with his wet beard in my face! Who needs coffee

I can't imagine getting hit by 250 pounds!

Tina, don't scare me now I have thus far managed to keep Gemma off the bed (though when she gets into "Crazy Dog" mode she jumps on to the bed and right off it, and thats allowed)......I guess I have to be very strict with Vassily about the "No getting on furniture" rule.....I already tell him to get off the sofa the minute he gets on it......lets see how it goes Callie and Vladimir are very good lookers, by the way.....how much do they weigh now?

Thanks! They have been very slow in their growth and weight gain. Callie is 25 inches tall and weighs 62 pounds. Vladimir is around 29 inches and weighed 92 this week at the his vet checkup. He just had a growth spurt and is at that gawky teenager stage and needs to fill out some.
You can always do what we did and buy a water proof, dirt colored couch! They sell them at Ashley.

These growth spurts are funny, aren't they? Vassily has surely grown taller since he got home - it's been exactly 2 weeks since he came home. He barely used to reach up to the coffee table, but now his head is clearly well above the coffee table! And his hind legs now look a little longer than his forelegs, so his rear isa little raised in proportion to his front Speaking of growth, today is Friday - Vassily's weekly weighing day! I have to first weigh myself, then pick him up and weigh both of us and then the difference between the two is his weight. And.....I have to do this with Gemma too (she's like 64 pounds), else, she'll think I "gave" Vassily something that I didn't give her

As for your couch idea, Tina, I am a bit of a stickler about house tidiness, but even aside from that, I don't want Vassily getting used to being on the couch - I don't want to be competing with him for couch space once he's grown bigger

Vijay

love all the posts.

the distrust of strangers - we've decided that bear has a 3x rule - he has to meet you 3x before he considers you a friend. and i generally tell people to ignore him the 1st time they meet him. just let him sniff them while they talk to me. the big dog lovers have a hard time with this.

the problem is their faces are soooo appealing! and people just want to run their hands through their fall! and this is soooo offensive to them! i tell people that it is equivalent to touching their privates.

now, when he was a puppy i didn't have these issues. and i socialized my boy alllllll the time! i even took him into the orthodontists office! (much to my daughter's dismay) people can love on them all they want while they are puppies. it's as they start to mature and that natural protective/mistrustful instinct kicks in that you have to start being smart about your stranger interactions. and in our case, doing protection training has intensified those instincts, which probably won't be your case.

bear is doing better and i'm being very intentional about putting him in situations to build his obedience, calmness among distractions, etc.

we went to a rally obedience class last night and it was good to be around experienced dog people. they know not to pet, to keep a distance, etc. but it tests his issues and it was really good. he also did really well in our put throughs for rally.

i would also say, if you have dog clubs around there, the sooner you get involved and get him doing puppy kindergarten, etc., the better his training will go. i wish i'd started at this particular club right off. i went through a trainer i wasn't crazy for and wasted several months.

I totally agree with you, Christy. They look almost like cocker spaniels when they are pups, so a lotta people feel compelled to pet them And again, they don't take Vassily's bark seriously because he is so small and "cute" (God, I HATE that word!!!). They find his barking at them amusing and say patronising things like "Ohhhhh, what a brave lil fella you are" and go right back to trying to pet him.

I tell anyone who comes home......"you are most welcome to pet him.....but you have to follow my rules, however silly you may think them and however seasoned a dog person you may think yourself to be....which is that you will not make any rapid movement towards him....you will not try to reassure him that "it's ok".......you will first talk to me in a casual tone for 2 minutes....and then you will let HIM approach you first and let him sniff you over......and then, when I say it is ok to do so, you will give him this treat which I give you......and only then bend down slowly and casually and touch his head gently". Some people find this procedure RIDICULOUS and laugh at me, but I smile back at them and say "you've always known me to be a bit of a pain-in-the-ass.......so just humour me".

May be my "procedure" as detailed above is overkill, and may be it IS ridiculous, but it works in getting Vassily comfortable with new people. It also reinforces (I hope) that he should rely on MY judgment (as opposed to his own) on who's ok. For the first 3 days, he took severe exception to my driver entering my house.....and then I made my driver do this procedure slowly and patiently, and now he is good friends with my driver

Vijay

I had an unrelated (to above post) question. Almost everyday, Vassily gets hiccups. They usually last 5-10 minutes when he lies down in a corner and keeps going "Hic! Hic!". It's quite funny to watch, but I just wanted to know if it's ok and normal? I can't see what harm a lil bit of hiccupping can do, but just wanna be sure. Any idea what could be causing it and any ways I can stop that? Thanks